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FOCAL REDUCER INFO 

Meade SCT Mount Focal Reducers

I was somewhat perplexed with the placement and actual focal reduction of the Meade f6.3 and the f3.3 focal reducers that I decided upon testing them with my equipment.  I had previously tested the 1.25" nose piece mounted Atik and Mogg focal reducers using M-103 so I decided to follow the same format of testing and use M-103 as my target again.  The equipment used for this test:

  Meade LX-200GPS/SMT 10" f10 Telescope on a Mitty Evolution Wedge
  Meade DSI Color CCD Imager
  Meade f6.3 Focal Reducer
  Meade f3.3 Focal Reducer

F3.3 Light Train
The basic light train for the f3.3 focal reducer consisted of the SCT with a Peterson Eyeopener II which is followed by the micro-focuser.  A Televue 2" nosepiece was screwed onto the front of the focal reducer which was then inserted into the rear of the micro focuser.  On the rear of the focal reducer either a T-Adapter or 1.25" barrel with thumbscrew was used.  A Televue T-Adapter was used as it is a one piece assembly instead of the Meade supplied T-Adapter which is two pieces.  Most of the testing was performed using the T-Adapter which was then screwed onto the DSI without it's 1.25" nosepiece.  Extension tubes of 15, 30 and 50 mm were inserted between the T-Adapter and the DSI in various combination to vary the actual focal reduction.  The following represent the various f3.3 light train combinations:

  SCT | Eyopener II | micro-focuser | 1.25" Adapter | DSI with nosepiece

  SCT | Eyopener II | micro-focuser | FR | T-Adapter 1.25" barrel | DSI with nosepiece

  SCT | Eyopener II | micro-focuser | FR | T-Adapter | DSI

  SCT | Eyopener II | micro-focuser | FR | T-Adapter | Extensions | DSI

The extension tubes could be connected in seven different combinations yielding extensions of 15mm, 30mm, 45mm, 50mm, 65mm, 80mm and 95mm.  Focus was unattainable when using combinations that were greater than 50mm.

F6.3 Light Train
The light train for the f6.3 focal reducer consisted of the SCT with the f6.3 focal reducer screwed onto the rear of the SCT which was followed by the micro-focuser.  A  Televue T-Adapter was  then screwed onto the DSI without it's 1.25" nosepiece.  The following represent the f6.3 light trains used:

  SCT | micro-focuser | T-Adapter | DSI 

  SCT | f6.3 focal reducer | micro-focuser | T- Adapter | DSI 

 

TESTING
The night of the test was July 20th 2005, the 36th anniversary of Neil's first step.  The Clearsky Clock indicated both poor seeing and poor visibility.  The moon was bright and hazy over the Southern horizon.

Nine images were acquired using the Meade Autostar Suite.  Each image consisted of at least twenty stacked images with a minimum quality setting of 50% with an exposure of 0.5 seconds.  All other settings were nominal, auto color - no dark subtracted - auto contrast.  The images were converted to FITS images and then analyzed using the AIP4WIN software to measure the pixel distance between two stars within the cluster.  Two sets of measurements were done using two pairs of stars as depicted in the following image of M-103.

The following tables & images summarizes the actual focal reduction data.

f3.3 FOCAL REDUCER DATA

Attachment Description Pr-1 pixels Pr-1 f/r Pr-2 pixels Pr-2 f/r F /  R Average

1.25 Nosepiece No F/R

307.33   101.38   1.0000
T-Adapter w/ Nosepiece 158.15 0.5146 52.31 0.5160 0.5153
T-Adapter w/ 00mm Ext 230.28 0.7493 76.12 0.7508 0.7501
T-Adapter w/ 15mm Ext 183.69 0.5977 60.34 0.5952 0.5964
T-Adapter w/ 30mm Ext 137.82 0.4484 44.79 0.4418 0.4451
T-Adapter w/ 45mm Ext 90.09 .2931 29.30 0.2890 0.2911
T-Adapter w/ 50mm Ext 73.79 0.2401 24.71 0.2437 0.2419

 

f6.3 FOCAL REDUCER DATA

Attachment Description Pr-1 pixels Pr-1 f/r Pr-2 pixels Pr-2 f/r F /  R Average

No Focal Reducer

334.92   110.01   1.0000
f6.3 Focal Reducer 166.39 0.4968 54.43 0.4948 0.4958

 

The following are the images used to derive the f3.3 f/r data.  


T-Adapter w/ Nosepiece = DSI @ f5.2


T-Adapter w/ 00mm Ext = DSI @ f7.5


T-Adapter w/ 15mm Ext = DSI @ f6.0


T-Adapter w/ 30mm Ext = DSI @ f4.5


T-Adapter w/ 45mm Ext = DSI @ f2.9


T-Adapter w/ 50mm Ext = DSI @ f2.4

The following are the images used to derive the f6.3 f/r data.  

No Focal Reducer = DSI @ f10


f6.3 Focal Reducer = DSI @ f4.9

 

CONCLUSIONS
Apparently, the advertised f3.3 and f6.3 are unattainable with my LX200GPS telescope.  This is most likely due to the variable nature of the Meade LX-200GPS telescope's focus mechanism.  Using the supplied spacers with the f3.3 focal reducer you can come close.  Using the 15mm spacer you can come close to f6 and if using both the 15mm and the 30mm spacers you will come close to f3.  

The f6.3 focal reducer when installed as Meade recommends was not close at all.  It calculated out to just under f5.

The f6.3 requires that I remove the Peterson Eyeopener II each time I use it.  When the f6.3 is installed along with either of my 2" diagonals, the diagonals only clear the base of the fork casting if I run the micro-focuser all the way in to its mechanical stops.  I can't get to Polaris for the iterative alignment dance any other way.

Since I use the focal reducers for imaging only, I have found it more versatile and convenient to use the f3.3 focal reducer and various combinations of the spacers.  I fear my f6.3 will gather some dust.  

 

1.25" Nose Piece Mount

I have used the following focal reducers which are compatible with screwing into a 1.25" eyepiece or the DSI nose.

Mogg 0.6 reducer 
Atik 0.5 reducer 
Mogg 0.3 reducer 

The 0.30 Mogg reducer is actually an extension tube to move the Mogg reducer further away from the CCD, it can also be used with the Atik reducer.

This yields the following combinations:

DSI + Mogg 0.6, yielding a focal reduction to about f 6 
DSI + Atik 0.5, yielding a focal reduction to about f 5 
DSI + Ext. Tube + Mogg 0.6, yielding a focal reduction to about f 3 
DSI + Ext. Tube + Atik 0.5, yielding a focal reduction to about f 2.5
DSI + Mogg 0.6 + Atik 0.5, unknown f stop 
DSI + Atik 0.5 + Mogg 0.6, unknown f stop 
DSI + Ext. Tube + Mogg 0.6 + Atik .5, unknown f stop 
DSI + Ext. Tube + Atik 0.5 + Mogg 0.6,unknown f stop 
DSI + Atik 0.5 + Ext Tube + Mogg 0.6, unknown f stop 
DSI + Mogg 0.6 + Ext Tube + Atik 0.5, unknown f stop 

Using my trusty Meade LX200GPS 10" scope and the DSI for testing, I was unable to achieve meaningful focus with the last two combinations involving both reducers split between the Ext. Tube. The two other combinations with the reducers coupled together at the end of the Ext. Tube yielded decent focus in the very center, but very poor on the edges. Because of the focus issues I did not use the last four combinations in my testing.

I focused each as best as the winds and sky conditions would allow on M103. The seeing was below average and the transparency was average and I live in some every light polluted skies, I have to look VERY hard to find Polaris each night. Each image consisted of 15 combined images without dark subtraction. I saved each of the resulting images and later brought each one into AIP4WIN processing software.

From within AIP4WIN I was able to measure the distance between stars. I measured between the larger star of the close double on the bottom edge and the bright orange/red star near the center of the cluster. 
This yielded the following pixel distance information:

DSI only, 346.73 pixels 
DSI + Mogg 0.6, 242.81 pixels 
DSI + Atik 0.5, 228.56 pixels 
DSI + Ext. Tube + Mogg 0.6, 158.79 pixels 
DSI + Ext. Tube + Atik 0.5, 111.25 pixels 
DSI + Atik 0.5 + Mogg 0.6, 116.33 pixels 
DSI + Mogg 0.6 + Atik 0.5, 98.41 pixels 

Now based on the assumption that the "DSI only" distance represents f10 the approximate f stops can be calculated.  If you divide the pixel distance for each of the reducer combinations by the "DSI only" pixel distance you should arrive at an approximate value that should represent the f stop for that combination.  Keep in mind that the Meade LX200GPS uses a moving mirror, the "DSI only" was probably not really at f10. But the number you come up with will be proportional in respect. Does that make sense to you folks? It did to me when I typed it...

Anyway this is what I came up with:

DSI only - f 10 
DSI + Mogg 0.6 - f 7 (0.70) 
DSI + Atik 0.5 - f 6.6 (0.66) 
DSI + Ext. Tube + Mogg 0.6 - f 4.6 (0.46) 
DSI + Ext. Tube + Atik 0.5 - f 3.2 (0.32) 
DSI + Atik 0.5 + Mogg 0.6 - f 3.3 (0.33) 
DSI + Mogg 0.6 + Atik 0.5 - f 2.8 (0.28) 

Below are my test images, from f10 to F2.8


f10

DSI @ f10.0


 

Imagine, a picture of our computer room

DSI - Mogg @ f7.0


 

Imagine, a picture of our computer room

DSI - Atik @ f6.6


 

Imagine, a picture of our computer room

DSI - Extension - Mogg @ f4.6


 

Imagine, a picture of our computer room

DSI - Atik - Mogg @ f3.3


 

Imagine, a picture of our computer room

DSI - Extension - Atik @ f3.2


 

Imagine, a picture of our computer room

DSI - Mogg - Atik @ f2.8



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Imagine, a picture of our computer room

C.A. Jagow